Planer...jointer...planer....jointer...pl......

[aschueler]

This has been going through my head lately as I found out I have a gift certificate worthy enough to buy one or the other, but not both.

In a few months, if funds allow, I would be able to add the other.

Wanted some experienced input: I am planning on a jointer (not sure which one yet) that can maybe do 8", before I get a planer for the following reasons:

1. I mostly work with s4s wood right now. My biggest irritation is the slight cupping or twist that seems to come no matter how nice it initially looks. With a planer, as long as I have one flat edge, I can flatten one face and get it square to that edge. Right?

2. I tend to get narrower boards anyway (6 inches or less) because they have less distortion. Hence, I have been laminating them anyway after doing cuts on the table saw. I think a jointer would allow me to laminate well.

3. IF I AM CORRECT, a planer pretty much gives you parallel sides + exact thickness, not square lumber, right? Can I get parallel sides with a jointer, just not exactly the same thicknesses? (ie, square one edge, the face joint with that edge against the fence, then edge joint the other side with now flat face against the fence?)

Can you guys tell I have never used a jointer/planer before?

Merry Christmas, thanks in advance to being kind to a newcomer.

[Terry Mac]

This has been going through my head lately as I found out I have a gift certificate worthy enough to buy one or the other, but not both.

In a few months, if funds allow, I would be able to add the other.

Wanted some experienced input: I am planning on a jointer (not sure which one yet) that can maybe do 8", before I get a planer for the following reasons:

1. I mostly work with s4s wood right now. My biggest irritation is the slight cupping or twist that seems to come no matter how nice it initially looks. With a planer, as long as I have one flat edge, I can flatten one face and get it square to that edge. Right?

2. I tend to get narrower boards anyway (6 inches or less) because they have less distortion. Hence, I have been laminating them anyway after doing cuts on the table saw. I think a jointer would allow me to laminate well.

3. IF I AM CORRECT, a planer pretty much gives you parallel sides + exact thickness, not square lumber, right? Can I get parallel sides with a jointer, just not exactly the same thicknesses? (ie, square one edge, the face joint with that edge against the fence, then edge joint the other side with now flat face against the fence?)

Can you guys tell I have never used a jointer/planer before?

Merry Christmas, thanks in advance to being kind to a newcomer.


I would go with a jointer first. A planner is nice, but squaring up the pieces is more important IMO. Once you get a flat square edge and at least one flat side, then I resaw to thickness using the table saw or band saw. Then cut to desired width.

Have fun shopping for the new machine, and let us know what you get! Post a few pics also!

[Don]

Hey, asc. There are many ways to skin a cat in doing woodworking. But . . . the typical method for making S4S is this.

#1 Jointer - face one surface
#2 Jointer - joint one edge utilizing the previous face surface against the fence
#3 Planer - face opposite surface from above operation #1
#4 Tablesaw - rip opposite edge parallel utilizing the edge from above operation #2
#5 Radial/Chop/Mitre Saw end one square
#6 Radial/Chop/Mitre Saw end two square

You can see that from this sequence the planer is needed twice to the planer's once. You should be able to decide from the materials that you typically use and the projects that you do what would be the best choice.

Shops on a budget are typically better off with a jointer first. Usually you are "recovering" wood that is not up to your standard as you stated. Wood turners can make do with just a jointer. But, people that need thinner than "off the shelf" S4S lumber can usually make use of a planer first. These people are more interested in making smaller items, jewelry boxes, small cases, etc. People that make larger items really need both.

QUOTE, "My biggest irritation is the slight cupping or twist that seems to come no matter how nice it initially looks." A planer is not designed to solve this problem. If the wood is cupped, the pressure roller can "press" the cup out of a wide board, leaving you worse off. And with twist, you will only get thinner wood with the same twist.

A jointer is a very different operation from most other woodworking steps. Each newbie in the hobby owes it to himself to understand this particular piece of equipment very early on. It does not operate like a simple hand plane. The infeed and outfeed tables work in concert with the cutterhead to produce straight stock. Keep in mind here the operative word here is straight. Set up correctly the machine will produce a straight edge. We "see" the machining operations as facing and jointing - but they are actually the same operation, just on two different surfaces.

When deciding on which jointer to buy; longer tables are more valuable than shorter - a 6" jointer is a fine size for most work, an 8" jointer will be a much better machine, but only because the whole thing is built heavier and has longer tables. Most often you will not utilize solid lumber in a project much wider than this. Why? Because if you are gluing for width then you will be alternating faces to keep the panels as flat as possible in the future. The width of those panels will be in the 6"-8" range.

Tuning and changing knives on a jointer could be a long thread all it's own. Once you learn and understand the principles you can really make one sing.

The largest jointers that I have worked on were around 16". We called them aircraft carriers because that is what they looked like. They would scare you to death; reaching over that much cutterhead to simply joint a board when you needed it. Plus, facing a board that wide is not for the weak at heart.

Good luck and let us know what you decide.

dawjr

[Joe C]

I agree with Don. You need to get the one face flat before running it through the planer. Go with the jointer first.

http://www.craftandwoodworking.com

[aschueler]

Thanks for the advice. Think I will need another couple of weeks;

It is mostly looking like a Ridgid (Home depot brand) jointer. I have a Ridgid table saw that I really enjoy and am getting to trust that brand, as it's often $100-$200 less than comparable stuff and seems reasonably solid.

Will let everyone know what I come up with.

[ComputerJohn]

Sounds like everyone has given some good information.

Just a little pointer with your new jointer. When you get it the blades will probably not be set correctly (they rarely are). Get a hold of a dial gauge and a magnetic stand. Check the height of the out feed table to the infeed table across the length of the table. From the out feed table make sure that the knifes are set flush and even across their length of the out feed table. This will take some time the first time you do this, but it is well worth it. Run a couple of piece through the jointer taking a small amount of material. You should have a nice even cut across the piece.

Remember, do not get in a hurry when using a jointer. Don’t take any more material then you need to remove and take a little at a time. You will get better results.

[bbiehl]

If you are not going to get a planer, then I would recommend getting an 8" jointer. I have both. I originally ordered a 6" jointer, but decided to upgrade to the 8" ... I am glad I did.

-brian

[dpmcreations]

A Jointer will be much more useful at first.. If you can afford it, go to the 8".. You will be pleasantly surprised at how much more useful it is to use it... If you are on a budget, go for the best product possible.. Also, take a look at brands like Grizzly, craftsman, ridgid, Delta (yes They sell affordable machines at Lowes.. LOL..) Good luck and let us know what you picked and how you like it.. Good glueing to you...

[aschueler]

Long story but the gift card thing didn't work out :)

I have budgeted enough for a jointer anyway. I really need advice here.

The ones that are locally available (ie I can take the truck to the store and come home with it) are the Rigid 6 1/4" and a Delta 6" ("Deluxe").

The range I am looking at is $300-400, cast iron top, free standing (NOT benchtop). I really want mobility (wheels or casters) too. Also, I just found out that the max board thickness on many of these is 3/4". Pretty much everything I work with and plan to work with will be 3/4". However, if I joint something until it's square, then it will almost always be less than 3/4", right? Seems like I will get close to nice square lumber, then it will be too narrow to actually be finished. Therefore, doesn't it make sense to get on that can handle LESS than 3/4" well? I should add that the wood I have is generally S4S to start with and already at 3/4".

So. Since the local ones 1. Don't have wheels and 2. May not handle less than 3/4" wood, then I ask you guys: what would you order?

Or even better: what do you have that you use & are happy with?

Thanks in advance.

[Don]

Hey, as. I don't understand the 3/4" limitation. You should only be limited by the width of the cutterhead, meaning that you will only be able to machine a 6" wide surface on a 6" jointer. Naturally, there are some safety concerns with jointing a board too thin, but you can certainly work material thicker and thinner than 3/4". Someone is pulling your chain.

Mobility is available for any jointer, some even come with wheels. Since you are in Keystone, you may want to road trip to the Woodcraft store here in town. They usually have a good selection of in stock jointers. Grizzly is another source that has merit. Delta has always been a good middle of the road selection. With your budget, most of them are going to be comparable.

This one is close to your budget and looks good too.

http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=2051

[old_guy]

Since you live near a Woodcraft store, I believe they are having a store-wide 10% off sale on March 1. Quite often they will sell power equipment several weeks in advance of that date. As Don said, that Jet 6" jointer is a pretty good machine for the money.

[aschueler]

Ah. Can you tell how much I need to learn?

The 3/4" limitation seems to be built into some of the jointers; the (not sure what it's really called) rotating feather board looking device has only 3/4" clearance on some models, making the board slide underneath.

Yeah, I guess I ought to make the trip into Jax to look at what they have there. I've been to the store and felt like I was in Disney. Maybe I can check their models online beforehand; the Delta, I must say, was cheaper at Lowe's than any place online, and that REALLY made it more attractive!

[bogydave]

Grizzly makes OK ones for the money & shipping for the lower 48 is reasonable.
Check it out ->
http://http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/G1182ZHW (http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/G1182ZHW)